Why Dish TV Is Betting on Gadgets, OTT, and Shopping
Insights on what it takes to transform a legacy broadcaster into a multi-platform, device-driven media company
In this episode of The Media Room, media journalist and author Vanita Kohli-Khandekar speaks to Manoj Dobhal, Group CEO of Dish TV India, about how the country’s oldest DTH brand is reinventing itself for the digital age. From the launch of a smart TV with built-in DTH and OTT, to the rapid growth of its Watcho and Flix platforms, Dobhal explains why Dish TV is leaning on its distribution strength rather than chasing expensive content bets. He takes us inside the company’s pivot into shopping and device ecosystems, its strategy to take Indian content global, and how it plans to stabilise revenues after years of decline in the core pay TV business.
They also discuss the wave of consolidation in Indian media, the lessons from global markets like Sky UK, and why Dish TV believes coexistence—not disruption—will define the future of television in India.
Tune in for insights on what it takes to transform a legacy broadcaster into a multi-platform, device-driven media company in an era of fragmentation and streaming wars.
(00:00) Introduction
(04:15) The State of India’s DTH and Pay TV Market
(07:22) How Dish TV Is Pivoting Beyond Linear Television
(11:10) Building Watcho: Strategy for OTT Aggregation
(15:36) Why Distribution, Not Content, Is Dish TV’s Strength
(19:48) Taking Lessons from Global Media Consolidation
(23:55) Watcho’s Revenue Model and Growth Path
(26:29) How Dish TV Plans to Stabilise Revenues
(30:04) Consolidation and Coexistence in the Indian Market
(33:55) Global Benchmarks: What India’s DTH Players Can Learn
(37:58) Why Dish TV Is Entering the Smart TV Business
(40:11) The Next 18 Months: Dish TV’s Transformation Plan
(43:26) No Mergers or Acquisitions on the Horizon
NOTE: This transcript is done by a machine. Human eyes have gone through the script but there might still be errors in some of the text, so please refer to the audio in case you need to clarify any part. If you want to get in touch regarding any feedback, you can drop us a message on [email protected].
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TRANSCRIPT
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar (host): Hello and welcome to the media room. Broadcast TV as we know it, old-fashioned TV remains by far the largest medium in India. It reaches about 900 million people and has traditionally been the largest part of the Indian media and entertainment ecosystem.
For four years now though, TV has seen some decline in revenues. In 2024 for the first time digital revenues overtook television revenues. I'm talking about pay and advertising revenues.
It is this declining trajectory of which both cable and DTH, which is direct to home, are a part. They are technologies which are used to carry traditional television or linear television as we know it to our homes. Dish TV, which was the first DTH operator in India, it was launched by Subhash Chandra's SL Group in 2003, has been around for as long as DTH has been in India.
Some time back I sat down with Manoj Dobal, who's the CEO of Dish TV, to talk about where TV is in India, where DTH is, how are they dealing with things and how is Dish TV placed. More on this with Manoj. Over to him.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Hi Manoj, good morning. Welcome to the media room. Lovely to have you on this show with me.
Manoj Dobhal: Very good morning, Vanita. I'm really equally excited, you know, thankful to you who got me here. So it's going to be exciting, I hope.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Well, you know, you're in an industry where the news has been always been patchy a bit because when it started, I remember in 2003, you guys launched or 2004? And it was such an upbeat time and I was there because I was covering these things that time. I just started covering media and that the whole thought of this new technology, which comes direct to home instead of coming through a cable operator, etc.
DTH did a good job. I think at its peak, it reached 70 million homes or roughly maybe 350 million people at its peak. But, you know, whether it is DTH, cable, cable and satellite, as we call it here, all these technologies are facing the usual challenges that online or internet has brought for all other industries within the media segment.
So just first, you know, instead of getting into the challenges, I'd like to just you to tell my listeners, where is Dish TV? A, within the media entertainment ecosystem. And more importantly, where is DTH within the whole media entertainment?
Manoj Dobhal: Sure, Vanita. I think you started with the tough one first.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: No, that's the easy one. I'm asking you to paint the canvas.
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, so basically, you know, we all know, the world knows, the Indian consumer knows that 2003 is when Indian consumers really got a taste of what a quality picture, sound, the so-called digital at that point of time, which is a craze, you know, tasted the real entertainment at a very personalised level. So it was like something coming direct from satellite to their homes. Unthinkable at that point of time, because people were used to terrestrial, we all know, move the antenna to set the picture right, to set the sound right.
And then there was some challenges with cable distribution also, in case of fibre cut and all the rainfades and all, there were huge issues with cable. And that is where people, you know, really looking for a revolutionary solution. And Dish TV was the pioneer, it remains the pioneer.
So, you know, fronting it straightaway, jumping into the scenario today, we have had a fair bit of success. We were always ahead of curve to provide anything around entertainment. And in fact, Dish TV was always the name to be looked at by the customer, whenever there was something to be, you know, pioneered in the form of technology platforms, you know, better quality of sound, next level of, you know, entertainment, content.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: What was the highest peak in terms of subscribers?
Manoj Dobhal: There is a merger which happened, we acquired D2H from Videocon in 70. And at that point of time, we were around 37 million subscribers, which were with us on a 90 day period. So that was the high time of DDS industry.
Digitisation, which was a mandated moment during different periods of time. We know DASH 1 happened, DASH 2 happened, DASH 3 happened, and then DASH 4, which was the interiors of, you know, India. So that also fuelled the growth of DTH.
These were the real, you know, peak days, heydays, and where, you know, the cable, you know, went down, people from cable dock went into DTH or pay TV. And people also moved from terrestrial to pay DTH platforms. So those were the real good times of the industry.
During COVID and, you know, around that period of around two years, OTT made inroads, technology was always evolving, data became cheaper, and, you know, easily available to the consumers. And that was the right time for OTT, you know, to make an inroad into the consumer individual gadgets. And people, all of a sudden, saw that they want to consume some entertainment at their time of convenience, or place of convenience, that is where OTT got the, you know, tailwinds and the headwinds started for DTH.
I think, as we stand today, the proliferation of data, the penetration of mobile mobility, that has really fuelled the customer, it has actually provided customer a lot of opportunities, a lot of options to view, you know, whatever they want to view, and, you know, whenever they want to view, wherever they want to view, right. So that has made it possible. And I think DTH companies also saw it, DISH was again the pioneer in this field, we launched our aggregation platform, OTT platform, I would say, three years back.
And today, as we speak, watcho is our OTT aggregation platform, not only it aggregates all the leading apps, one would, you know, aspire to subscribe, it also provides a lot of content, which is not available in the big platforms, which is created by the professional content creators in this country. And there are a huge number of them who do not find a good platform for publishing or distributing their creation.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: You're talking about Flix.
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, we are talking about Flix. So today we have more than more than 3000 hours of content, actually 4000 hours of content available on whatever basis customer wants to consume, this is a complete freedom for the content creator as well as the consumer. Right.
And you have a board available, you have, you know, pay-per-view available, you have subscription for the channel available on a, you know, you want to go subscribe for a monthly basis, you have it available. So anything that you can think of, and what it does, it really blurs the boundaries of the regional, for the regional content creators to go beyond their geographic, you know, limitations. So think of a situation where the content creator has created something very unique, which he thinks can get the fall and, you know, monetization for him, but he doesn't have an OTT platform.
And, you know, we are able to create an OTT platform. So where does he go? He goes and publish it to a FTA platform, you know, free platform, A word platform, but there he gets lost in the middle of, you know, so many promoting it themselves.
So his content is not seen, the discovery of his content for consumers becomes a problem. Right. So he doesn't get anything out of that.
He doesn't want to part away with that because that means that he has to compromise with his creativity, with his rights on it, if he sells, you know, cheap to some, you know, distribution platform. So he doesn't want to do that either. So there is a, I mean, very startling number, if you look at for every movie that is released, there are six or seven, which get produced, but never see the end of the tunnel, light of the day, actually.
So they are sold somewhere. But these are really gripping content, very compelling content to watch. And that is where this thought of, you know, creating a creator's economy, which is what Flix does today.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Yeah. But, you know, this thing of deluge of content, the fact is we are swimming in a sea. And I think we're looking at the most pampered consumer in India right now, if you talk about the 500 million odd people that the internet reaches.
But just to, and I'm going to come back to this, to Watcho and Flix and everything, but just to come back a bit to DTH and linear broadcasting. So where is Dish right now in terms of number of subs? And I understand completely that you've done a whole lot of this getting into aggregation, getting into Watcho and Flix.
For example, when we talked about it, remember we said it's the YouTube for, you know, for smaller filmmakers who want to put their stuff.
Manoj Dobhal: I was refraining from using that word. Yeah, but that's right.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: I can use it. I don't have any competitive pressure. But, but no, but my point is, like this morning when I was looking, the trajectory is still a falling trajectory as far as revenue goes.
What, you know, at what point do you think it could get arrested and what could arrest it? So you're doing a whole lot of things. So two questions here.
One is, where are you right now in terms of subs, etc. And when is this trajectory going to stabilise in terms of revenues?
Manoj Dobhal: So, Vanita, let me be candid. It's not only Dish TV, which is facing this, you know, decline of subscribers and revenue. This is after a customer got those choices.
And see, India, Indian households are actually divided in a pyramid. So if you look at the bottom of the pyramid, there are around, you know, around 80 million, around 8 crore households who do not have a TV at all. So if you go to the states like, you know, Bihar, Jharkhand, UP, MP and all, TV penetration is really very low as compared to South, right, where it is, you know, already peaked to 95, 97, 98% in some states, actually.
So there are around those 7, 8 crores easily households which are not having a TV. And that is what is fuelling the growth of TV. So which is actually an opportunity for us, if you ask me, going forward, because more and more people are, you know, buying TV and the industry is really flourishing.
And you see a lot of people jumping into that, you know, industry now. The brands which are never heard of, you know, they are also thinking about getting into the consumer space, right? I am talking about big, you know, business houses.
What is and that's one segment. Next segment to that is the free dish segment, the customer who doesn't want to pay on a regular basis on a monthly basis, like they pay for cable TV or DTH. So there are good, you know, 5 million plus households already subscribe to free dish.
What they want is a free available content to them without the need to recharge. Then there is the pay TV segment, which is split between cable TV and DTH. This has gone significantly down, like you said, from 70 million at one point of time, we are at around, you know, around that 50 million mark.
In the last five years, it has really seen a lot of erosion. Where the people have gone, I'm just connecting to that. So they are either moved to free entertainment, which is available on the platform through Prashar Bharti, Fridish, or they have moved to OTD or the hybrid ecosystem.
Right? So there are hard, I mean, there are some pure cord cutters around 3 to 4 million, maybe 5 million touching now, who do not want to watch anything on pay TV. And they are purely OTD streaming now, video on demand.
And, you know, so many apps which are, you know, making a good business case for them. But where the customer from pay TV, cable and DTH both has gone, either it has moved down, not wanting to pay, or it has moved up to hybrid ecosystem where they have a connected device at their home connected TV, or through a fire stick, making the TV smart, and consuming the hybrid, you know, kind of content of OTD as well as TV. So this is where the base has gone.
What we have done, I think we were a little late to react to that shifting, you know, consumer behaviour. And we're not, I mean, the launch of these OTD aggregation was not timed nicely by all of us. And it's not us, it's all the DTH platforms.
The companies who are into telco space, they had an advantage because they were getting access to home easily. And we did not have that advantage at all. So the revenues have declined for us, for any DTH brand for that matter, unless they had a connected ecosystem, offering integrated service along with telephony, mobility, I'm talking of fixed and wireless both, as well as broadband and DTH subscription, right.
So that is where the customer went to. In last couple of quarters, we have seen the decline of subscriber has not bottomed out, I would not say it has bottomed out, but the pace at which it is going down has reduced. And even for us, it has reduced.
What happened in between what fuelled this growth of OTD and nonlinear pay TV was the stand taken by the broadcasters, right. So there was, we have always been talking about it that there is a, you know, not a level playing field when it comes to providing the content and charging for the content. So what do we do, basically we package whatever we take from the broadcasters, we don't produce anything of our own.
So there was some bit of bias, I would say, or I would say, less preferential treatment to pay TV at that point of time to linear TV at that point of time. And this is what the broadcaster realised about a couple of quarters, you would have been seeing now a lot of people and the broadcaster talking about pay TV is still, you know, gives them the bulk, you know, bulk of the revenue. And it is it was not really nice to overlook it at the cost of putting money into OTD and all that.
So that sense has now come back amongst the broadcaster friendly. And they are, they have plans and they are working to revive the TV business, you would have seen the relaunch of Kyon Ki Saas Bhi Kabhi Bahut Hi, right, bringing back Tulsi, that Tulsi girl, I mean, Sumitri Nanaji by star. So there's a lot of focus just come back on a lot of content, which was a desirable, like, for example, cricket is a religion in this country.
So we saw between two, you know, big giants to garner the, you know, customers as many as they wanted. So they went, they made cricket free, available to the customers on OTT platform, although they were being charged at pay TV, linear TV.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Just to come back one minute, because you made several points in what you were saying, which I want to pick up. Because one of the things is you and we're looking at a total TV population of what now? I mean, including smart and including cable, free dish, everything, are we still at 150-200 million homes or are we less than that total TV homes?
Manoj Dobhal: So if you see total TV homes is around 180 million homes.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Correct. And DD free dish, 30-40 million, 50 million, that's the number I Yeah, 50 million is what they claim. Yeah.
But you know, the thing I find fascinating and I worry about this is they hit 50 million or 40 million, whatever the figure, because nobody tracks those figures, the government of India or This is the number of boxes sold here. So why didn't DTH players get this market? Why couldn't you launch a free service yourself and get that market?
Because that market has gone to YouTube, that market has gone to DD free dish. It's not that people stopped watching linear TV. It is that they were watching it on a free platform or in streaming format.
So why did that shift not happen to you guys or to Tata play or whoever else?
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, so that's really where I wanted to bring the discussion to. So we're talking of that pyramid of households, how many households India has, you know, split between TV dark to pure, you know, corporate. Now, this segment, we realised it around three years back.
And that is why we said that this TV has always been catching the pulse of the customers ahead of time. We figured it out that this is a consumer shift, which is happening to the bottom side of the pyramid. And we launched around three and a half years back, a service, a similar service, a product called Zing Super.
So what is Zing Super? For these kind of customers, the option is very simple that you do not pay recurring to me, you just subscribe, like you're subscribing to free dish. And your subscription now is free for next four years.
And four years is a lifetime for a, you know, box for hardware. And that is why we kept it four years, we initially experimented with two years, but then we thought we understood that people want a longer, you know, validity for their hardware to run. So we already have a product in that segment.
And this TV is the only brand only company, which is providing an option other than free dish to that segment of that cohort of customers, where they can just buy a Zing Super box of this TV, pay one time and nothing to pay for next four years, the subscription keeps on going. So all which is available on free dish is available on Zing Super. Plus, we keep on and the beauty of the product is that it is not a block or a locked device.
It is still has an option for you where you want some marquee content, which you want to subscribe now, but your box doesn't allow it that option has been negated. So what do we do? We have given the option to the customer, if you want to say watch a series of cricket, which is coming only is not coming on free dish, there's a lot of cricket, which doesn't come on British, right, which is, you know, offset of source series as an overseas series and all right, so that doesn't come free, of course, on free dish.
So if you want to subscribe to that content at that point of time, maybe 30 day period or 45 day period, there's an option for you pay for that particular one content that you want to view, or there is some great movie on any XYZ channel, right, even if it is, say, linguistic, I mean, vernacular, maybe Malayalam movie or a Marathi movie, and you see that it's coming on a particular channel, right, or something is coming on Star Jalsa, or maybe, you know, I mean, Star Telugu or some Star Mind all that. So if you're watching something coming on Zee Malayalam or Zee Bengali or Zee Telugu, so you can just subscribe for that channel on the Rio rate published by that broadcaster and still watch that movie. What are your subscribers right now?
What proportion is it? We are around 1.6 million at this point of time, but like I said, this is just a very recent journey. This is 1.6 million for Zing?
Yeah, Zing super is 1.6 million already.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: As a proportion of your total, what is it?
Manoj Dobhal: This will be already around 15%. 15% of your total. Yeah, so we'll be somewhere around, you know, 12 million subscribers now on a 90 day engagement basis.
This will be around that 15% contribution. So we are conscious of that where the customer is shifting, and that is we have heard the whole pyramid very nicely. At the bottom, you have Zing super, then you have Dish TV, right as a brand available in pay TV segment, linear segment, and then we have watch as an aggregation.
At the top of it, people who are just want to add revenues go up.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Are you seeing any uptick in ad revenue? Because that will become the bulwark now.
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, that is where the thought lies that this should become bigger. I think 1.6 million at this point of time is not that big a number to start, you know, monetising the ad revenue. But yes, that remains an agenda.
Maybe in a year's time, you'd be around 3 to 4 million and that is where the serious money comes in from the ad revenue.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: But this is also you have to look at a multiple. If you're talking 1.6 million, average family size of four and that would be the multiple in terms of reach, no?
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, absolutely right.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Absolutely. People think 1.6 million people, but that's not true. Because it's 1.6 million households.
Manoj Dobhal: Absolutely right. Correct. Yeah.
So that translates around 5 to 6 million people that we are reaching through that product. And this is unique. Nobody has it.
Tata doesn't have it. Sun doesn't have it. You know, Airtel doesn't have it.
So we are only other than 3Dish, who has this product, you know, offered for the customers.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: But you know, Manoj, and this is probably a broader question, but Dish has been part of everything. And because you were part of the SL group, and Zee was one of the first private satellite channels to come in, and then Dish was the first DTH operator to come into India. And in fact, City Cable was among the first cable operators, all part of the SL companies.
But it's amazing to me that for the company that brought in TV into the country, why has this, you know, why have you not been able to ride this particular way? Or is it that we are looking at a trowel? Or will it stabilise with watcho, with zing, with flicks?
Do you see this stabilising at some point? Because already you can see, streaming is a professional curated OTT. I can see a stability in the audience size and reach now.
It has hit some kind of little ceiling until it goes. That is why they are all linearising. That's why everybody is doing popular shows.
You know, they are doing the same thing that TV did. But similarly, is TV doing something to get at that audience which these guys have taken away?
Manoj Dobhal: See, so that is one of the tailwinds, like you said. And I will not say that this decline was because of the behaviour or the, I mean, strategy or approach broadcast. It is not, I'm not blaming them for that.
But yes, it has, it had its contribution. And like you said, all these OTT companies, I don't think any of them is profitable even today. Right?
Despite four to five years, six year and eight to 10 year runs, you know, they have already enjoyed, right? So they have not made profits till date. OTT business for me, if you ask me, is a business where there is an instant output.
So that's the way I look at it. So people would go, it's an instant output in the sense when I'm saying instant output means it's a success or a failure in a very short horizon. Right?
So you will see some of the OTT platforms making headlines, trending for a particular period of time in a year and then, going into oblivion. So it's a business where you need to constantly keep on putting money into technology, personalised recommendation. So that's an always evolving journey for the customers, for the broadcasters.
They have to keep investing into content. And the moment you don't, you know, you take your foot off the pedal, you know, the subscriber keeps going away because the subscriber is not looking for the platform, he's looking for the content. So wherever the content is available, he will move.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: But this applies to customers also, right?
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah. And that is why we are not a standalone OTT platform. We are an aggregator.
So we have got all the content available. So customer doesn't have to go anywhere from the platform. And like you rightly said, the, you know, stagnation or the fatigue is already coming into OTT, I mean, expansion further.
And people have now started taking share from each other. The time has come where the customer also would evaluate his options now, right? Between, you know, what is giving me the beauty about Indian customers, they are very, very, you know, great value seekers, right?
It's not that they want cheaper product or they don't want to pay the price. But for the price that they are paying, they want basic value of the life, right? And the beauty of WATCHO is that, that's a value proposition for the customer.
There is a content available from all the leading broadcasters, all the leading platforms in OTT space. We also have a content which is created by professional creators, which is not available anywhere else.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: WATCHO is an auto reward. I mean, what, how is it, what is the revenue model for WATCHO?
Manoj Dobhal: WATCHO has a subscription model. It is not A-Word as of now. But within WATCHO, it's fixed, which is A-Word, pay-per-click, even S-Word.
So WATCHO is giving that flexibility and there's so much of content, this plethora of content which is available. So that transition is going to happen.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: How was the transition in that business in WATCHO and in Flix? What transaction, I mean, how many subs? I mean, some sense of how that is going and also, you know, and therefore, do you see in two years, three years, some sort of stabilising of revenues and going back on a growth and profitability path?
Manoj Dobhal: See, we are very, very, you know, new in this space as of now. Our subscribers, as well as Dow Mouse, the active subscribers on the network, the amount of content they are consuming on the network, it's actually growing by multiples. It's not a linear trajectory of growth that we are seeing here.
We started barely this business about one and a half year back, the WATCHO aggregation business. We are already at the cusp of six crore per month of revenue from this. And the moment it touches that 10 crore threshold, I think we would be the only OTT platform which will be profitable.
And because we are not investing into content, we have our philosophy, our strength very clearly defined that we are good at distribution. We are uniquely positioned as an interface between the content and the consumers. So we know both sides of it, right?
So what the customer, the broadcaster through OTT, they will be having a lot of insights and that is why they are trying to, you know, I mean, sharpen their recommendation engines and all. But we have a lot of learnings already available from this and we are incorporating the best of the practises. There's going to be a larger focus on strengthening this business.
So this is where Twitch TV is going to pivot from where it is now. We have lost enough. We know that.
But now the product, you know, suit that we have available right from the bottom of the pyramid to the top of the pyramid. We have everything available as a product. We need to just, you know, I mean, reach out to more audiences, make our USP very, very clearly established with them and people are ready to, people will take it up.
We are very sure about it. That's where the future lies. So we are really not, I will not say we are not concerned, but we are not really extremely bothered about it.
Our DTS revenue is declining. It will stabilise. We have already seen the sign of it.
I think this is the first quarter, the last quarter where we have not declined over the last quarter. So we are almost stable.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: One of the things is, that's very nice to hear because I think all technologies have the potential to coexist. You know, one of the things which I've seen and the biggest merger which happened, which was Viacom and Star and therefore Reliance and Star or Disney. I mean, that has created something which has assets, which are across linear, across and they're significantly large assets.
It's not like 5-10 million you had on OTT and you had a nice 20-30% share in. They are large dominating shares in both. So there's this one big consolidated entity, Zee and Sony talked and the merger never happened.
But there is a wave of consolidation as far as legacy media is concerned. And I think in India, not much is left. I mean, there's a Sun TV and there is a Zee and the Sony data play.
But what is this kind of consolidation at the broadcast end and the streaming end? What does it mean? Not just for Dish TV, but how has it changed the market?
Because you know, it is at this point, actually what I'm trying to ask is, there are so many changes happening. One is a technology shifts happening. The other is this massive bits of consolidation happening at the industry level.
How do you, what shape is this market taking and where does therefore Dish TV fit into this changing shape? I mean, what does consolidation mean for you? For you, what has it done?
And then how do you sort of deal with it?
Manoj Dobhal: So we thought initially that it would be a challenge to the, you know, platforms when such a big merger happens. Of course, the best out of it is always there. It comes with that.
And like we said, we do not produce anything. We always bundle what broadcasters provide us and sell it as a package, as a new package to the customers, which they do not want to, which they are doing through OTT. Initially, we thought it's going to be challenging, but now we have been coexisting as an industry.
The broadcaster also understands for them, reach is very, very important. Right. And reach comes from all, a mix of all the platforms.
So there are customers who are really loyal. There are, you know, we still have customers who are 10 year old and still sticking to us. Right.
So they know that each and every customer reach is very, very household reach is very, very important for them. And there is always that, you know, middle path, which is always, you know, arrived by mutual discussions and knowledge and expertise of the domain. They are great.
I mean, whatever anybody can say, TV still is flourishing in India. And there are only two platforms, you know, two technologies which take your content to TV, which is MSO and DDH. Right.
Increasingly, the attention of the broadcasters going back to TV, you're seeing that already. Right. So a lot of headwinds are now turning into little, small tailwinds at this point of time.
If you look at the ad revenue as well, this is not only a business of subscription revenue for broadcasters, the bigger money lies, the bigger buck lies in the ad revenue for them. And even today, the CAGR for digital might be very high. Right.
But if you look at the contribution, it is still around 50-50. To the media industry overall, correct? Yeah, for the media.
Right. And there are hard to reach areas for the customers, for the broadcasters. So that remains an enigma for them how to reach a customer at an individual level.
Right. So I think all of these are all the people, you know, all the geniuses are very well aware of the situation, how India plays as an industry. So there is enough, like you say, there's enough to coexist for all of them.
Challenges are there, we know it. But like you said, we have been working in the same industry. So we have that respect for each other that, you know, these are the nuances of the business, which has to be factored in.
Right. Which we understand. And consolidation, if you look, the other ease it brings to us is that there's always that, you know, push and pull happening between the broadcasters, you know, on what kind of monetization on subscription or, you know, carry, I mean, carrying the channel to the customers and all.
That push and pull always keeps on happening. So when you have fewer people to deal with, in that sense, it's actually an advantage, rather a disadvantage for us.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: My question is, the impression I get is that the broadcast and linear television distribution business in India is in a much better space than its global counterpart. And how have global companies dealt with losing or I mean, just keeping share of audiences when they're shifting? Because even overseas, there's a whole thing of fast, there's a whole thing of free DPH, especially in the UK market.
How have those companies kept? I mean, are you seeing any benchmark business models emerging there? So there are two questions here.
One, have we coped better with the shift to digital than our global compatriots? And two, are there any interesting business models emerging from those markets that are far more challenged on digital than we are?
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, you're right. Actually, if you see, there have been both sides of the stories available globally. So if you look at somewhere around, you know, Far East, which is Malaysia, Indonesia, right.
And if you look at canal, for example, right, so they have coped better ahead of time, they adopted the technology much before us. There are some cases also there like Sky of UK, you see, they have, you know, moved into a complete ecosystem of entertainment offering to the customer. So and we, I think where we lack, I would rather, there are a lot of, you know, strengths we can draw from, you know, these examples.
If you see DTH, companies in India, they have, I would not use the word complacent, but they were a little behind the curve in pivoting the business at the right time. Right. So that's how I see it.
If you look at Sky UK today, so they did not restrict themselves to just a content pipe. And there are many more examples like that. So what they said, I have access to the home, right?
Why do I remain stuck at a content pipe and a STV box for the customer? Right. They kept on innovating on the kind of product in terms of the box.
So now we have, we started with standard definition, then we went to high definition, then we went to actually PVR, we would say personal video recorder in that. Then we went to Android, then Android 4K, and all those kinds of investments were happening. But it was happening all around the content pipe, right?
Trying to better the product there. We never saw a fully integrated ecosystem, a front-end integration and a back-end integration. When I have the access to home, when I am providing the content pipe, why can't I provide the screen?
Right. So why does that customer need to buy a box from me, a TV from Samsung, or LG, or Sony, or a Haier, or a Lloyd, or a TCL, for that matter? Why can't, customers are looking for a one-stop solution everywhere.
And that's how this concept of mall, platforms, e-platforms, e-malls, and all, it came from there only. Customer doesn't want, he wants convenience. And in DTH, customer is definitely a convenience seeker.
Right. And that's why you have three-month plan, six-month plan, one-year plan, all that, because people want to pay one time and get away with it. One-stop solution for entertainment needs.
So this is, if you see, if you look at Sky UK, they, you know, sense this well ahead of time, and they went into, I mean, offering a complete solution to the customer. I was surprised when I saw they were selling even mobiles and SIM cards, because they know the customer is consuming content either on a smart TV or a linear TV, which is not smart, or on a mobile handset or a laptop. And if you go to their site, you'll see they're selling everything.
Each and every gadget is listed there. They came out with their own brands also. So that opportunity is still there in India.
And I don't think any DTH company has made any inroads in that. They might have tried, but they tried solution which was around IoT or, you know, internet connection. So like surveillance, security surveillance, you know, for that you need broadband first.
And if a DTH provider is not providing broadband service, why would he subscribe to your, you know, security surveillance service, he would go to somebody who's providing that.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: The job of a set-top box is being done by a smart TV already, because it comes pre-embedded with apps, etc. So, you know, in fact, one broadcaster was worrying, I interviewed him some months back, and he was worrying, and he said that these guys will become the, what the cable operators were earlier, you know, the guys who sell the smart TV brands, because they control the landing pages, they control the order in which the fast channels move.
Manoj Dobhal: Absolutely. And you'll, and you'll be surprised today, there are people in these TV brands, who are content specialists and content experts. They have advertising departments.
Yeah, and there are mandates, the mandates are very clear to them that you need to bundle as much content as possible. So a TV brand is looking for a forward integration through content. Why can't a content provider or platform look for a backward integration for, you know, gadgets or devices?
Yeah. So we have, we are conscious of that. And we are very soon, I think, in your, you know, podcast, I can really happy and delighted to share.
And we are very soon coming out with our own proposition where the customer does need to buy only a TV provided by us. Doesn't need to go for an STV, any fire extinguisher, everything is built in there. And his need of entertainment is taken care.
You have OTT bundled into it, you have DTH bundled into it, and we are giving you the device. And there is a range of device that you can choose from.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: So this is a smart TV, basically, that you're, you're going to be.
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah. Yeah.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: We are coming out with a smart TV. When are you launching it? This is very good, big news.
When are you launching it?
Manoj Dobhal: It will be max 45 to 60 days from now.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: And what are you calling it? Do you have a brand name?
Manoj Dobhal: Yeah, we have a brand name.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Not to be revealed?
Manoj Dobhal: Not to be revealed. I think it will still be a time of launch.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Fantastic. I hope it works. I really hope because I really think that you need that, you know, India is such a diverse market, so many business models, so many formats.
You just need companies to think. I was looking at this company Invest Bengal, which started investing in theatres because they saw their box office going down. They said, boss, we have to invest in the theatres.
I mean, it's a production company, SVF Entertainment, if you know them. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, I have last couple of things, Manoj.
One is three years from now, what are we looking at two years from now, whatever your time frame? I know you're a listed company, so you can't make many forward-looking statements. But two, three years from now, where do you see Bishti?
And also, are you looking to acquire, merge, do something?
Manoj Dobhal: Okay, so two years is a longer horizon now because we've been really doing a lot of spade work. Why I'm saying long horizon, just allow me a minute more. So the kind of spade work we have been doing in trying to pivot this organisation, I think we don't need two years anymore.
That's why I said it's longer horizon. In maybe 12 to 18 months only, you will see Bishti being known for a lot more than what Bishti is known for today. We are looking at all opportunities.
Like you said, there are so many business models which are there. Bishti is a great brand. We have a great distribution team.
We have a great connect with customers. We know the content inside out, how to bundle it, how to package it. There are a lot of investments we are making on selling the right or giving the right offering to each and every cohort at an individual level, I would say, not even cohort.
So Bishti would be known for much more than just a linear pay TV business from now. And one such example, I just said we are going to, and when I said we're talking about TVs, it's not that I'm talking in thin air. In the last three months, we have actually tried this, piloted this.
We got some TV manufacturer to give us some quantities and we tried to sell it through our distribution and we really made good success in that. So we have already tested the POC. So this is one such thing.
And like I said, there's a lot of integration to be done on the gadget ecosystem, on the device ecosystem. And there's nobody better place than us because we are already giving you content, right? So that is one thing.
So, and on the ODD platform also, unlike Flix is just beginning, we have an objective and mission to take it international actually. So in 18 months time, you will see Indian consumer getting an access to a lot of international content dubbed in the language that they want. And a lot of Indian content, regional content, which doesn't reach its global diaspora, right?
Because of the limitations they have. So a lot of content going from Indian, breaking those boundaries and going international. So there's a lot which is in store for this TV.
And like I said, we have done all the groundwork, all the spade work, the hard work which required to be done, the capital which was required to be done in that has already been done. We are just taking it live, maybe quarter by quarter from now.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Great. One thing, I know that there are no opportunities for mergers within DTH, but outside of DTH or outside of cable or outside of even distribution platforms per se, is there anything on your horizon in terms of I need to acquire these assets? Because this is my business plan and because you've done shopping, you've got a shopping thing, you've got watcho, you've got flix, you're doing smart TVs now.
Any announcements coming there on mergers or acquisitions or you merging with someone?
Manoj Dobhal: I think that is not on our radar at this point of time. I think there's a lot to do based coming out of our own strengths. And that is why we thought we should go to that shopping port, QCommerce platform, because that space is not crowded yet.
There are hardly any players in that. And we are the only network or the only brand which has physical as well as digital network. So a lot of e-coms and all, they just go e-com, a lot of brands they go e-com just because they don't have a physical network.
And we really rule it on the ground. So for us, these are real strengths which we can build up from. So we don't need to really acquire or merge with anybody.
Anything happens on that, it will be at the shareholder or promoter level. I don't think we need to look at that. And that is why you would have been seen last.
I think we didn't speak about Content India. So Content India was not something out of day we thought and coming out of some winches and fancies because we were building all this ecosystem for flakes, for creator economy, for taking our content global or getting the global content to India, blurring those boundaries. It required an ecosystem and engagement with the international threat.
And that is why we were ahead of time compared to anybody. Even before our honourable PM came out with that waves thing, we were much ahead of time in terms of thinking and implementing it. So Content India is another stepping stone that will help all these initiatives build the business that we want to really build and not to be known only as a linear pay TV brand for the future.
For 18-24 months, that is the journey that we are going to skip.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Inshallah, that's how it should work out. Fantastic. That was a great conversation, Manoj.
Thank you so much for talking to me and for being part of the media room.
Manoj Dobhal: Thank you so much, Vanita. It's been really great.
Vanita Kohli-Khandekar: Thank you. Thanks.
